Holding The Space

What does holding the space look like? Why is it important? And how can you implement it into your rhythm? Melisa explains holding the space as, the concept of being energetically present, and when that energy is removed things tend to go haywire. Learning to hold the space is vital in creating a smooth rhythm in your homeschool (and general family life). Below you’ll find the video Melisa and her husband Erik recorded to answer all things holding the space related. Try it out! 


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00:04     hello everybody I'm Melissa Nielsen

00:08     hello

00:09     that's Eric Nielsen we're on three

00:12     different different laces so bear with

00:14     us each cameras framed a little bit a

00:17     little bit differently so we wrapped him

00:21     because I wanted him to be able to talk

00:24     about like dad and holding the space

00:27     honey you're hung up on that cord right

00:29     there

00:29     look look down sorry yeah one second oh

00:36     that's better

00:38     yes there you go so I wanted to have

00:40     like dad's perspective because I think

00:42     holding this face is a big deal

00:44     mm-hm in fact we have we've done this

00:47     training program before it's like a free

00:49     video and when people have to do it

00:51     again the summer called straight talk

00:52     about your kids bad behavior and often

00:57     when we're doing that what comes out is

00:59     that the bad behavior is is always tied

01:03     to mom and dad yes like always but

01:06     before we talk about that I want to talk

01:08     about our thinking feeling willing

01:09     program so so stick with us I actually

01:12     have a couple of things one if you

01:16     because we're closing tomorrow the the

01:19     doors close to thinking feeling willing

01:20     tomorrow not sure when we're reopening

01:22     yes we'll launch it again but I'm not

01:25     sure when so it will it will be later

01:29     this summer but y'all don't want to wait

01:31     because you really maybe it started

01:33     planning your school year now so if you

01:36     are somebody who's been like praying and

01:38     hoping and figuring out to the universe

01:40     I need a miracle just know that Eric and

01:42     I are praying for you Americans too

01:43     because when when when that that you

01:47     know happens for you and you're open for

01:49     it and then you can come in a week and

01:51     help you work miracles in your life with

01:53     with your schooling and with your

01:54     partner and with your parenting and all

01:56     of that so please know that we are

02:00     they're ready to help like I said it

02:02     closes tomorrow night but I want to say

02:05     this for any money who pulls the trigger

02:08     and decides to purchase while we're

02:10     talking will be out here for probably 45

02:12     minutes or so during our call I have

02:15     something extra special that I'm gonna

02:17     send you it's secret so okay I love our

02:25     office you know normally see yeah I know

02:27     I was looking at that you see this

02:28     there's this thumb for anybody who likes

02:31     Pacific Rim any dad's watching Eric

02:34     that's Eric site of his of the desks

02:36     right there so you see lettuce a little

02:39     bit

02:39     bits of food the office so what is

02:42     thinking feeling willing so yes it is a

02:46     way to get all of your Waldorf

02:48     homeschool curriculum in one place

02:50     there's that but that's like this much

02:53     of thinking feeling really really it's

02:56     like this much of it so Eric and I our

02:59     marriage and parenting coaches and I've

03:01     been a homeschool curriculum coach for

03:03     more than ten years and so a long time

03:06     and we have five children or blended

03:09     blended family my older three children

03:12     are from my first marriage and Sammis

03:14     Raya the younger ones wants to see

03:16     Oliver and Mister stories are from the

03:19     Savannah so but he's actually adopted

03:23     some of our adult children so he's the

03:27     band he's the dad so we've been at this

03:31     a long time and we worked with thousands

03:35     of families a lot of families a lot of

03:37     families over the years and so what we

03:39     teach is stuff that we know that we back

03:42     up with like well you know we're doing

03:44     it every day and we're working we're

03:46     doing those the things that we were that

03:48     we recommend are things that we do we

03:51     don't we don't tell you to do anything

03:53     that we don't already do somebody will

03:55     ask me hey what about XY and Z I'll say

03:58     you know what I don't know anything

03:59     about that so I can't I can't give you

04:00     an opinion we only talk about things

04:02     that we do so I want to talk about

04:05     thinking feeling willing program and

04:07     then we're going to talk about holding

04:07     the space so don't go anywhere if you

04:11     are thinking feeling willing

04:12     feel free to chime in and shine about

04:15     how much you love your membership and if

04:19     you have questions you're welcome to

04:21     drop me a DM if you're on instagram or

04:23     PM if you're on facebook or drop me an

04:25     email Melissa at Waldorf essentials comm

04:28     I'm happy to help you so again it is a

04:32     way to get your water from school

04:34     curriculum but that's about this big of

04:36     it that much of it we also provide

04:40     training and the reason why our training

04:44     is different is because homeschooling is

04:45     different from being a school much

04:48     different and it's different depending

04:50     on who you are absolutely absolutely

04:52     because we talked so much about like how

04:54     you show up and and to your Hyland dad

04:57     who you're you know what your

04:59     temperament is and and the work you're

05:01     doing on yourself so all of those pieces

05:03     determine then you know how you show up

05:07     and we're actually tomorrow's training

05:09     is called understanding authenticity and

05:11     so you'll want to join us for that

05:12     that's at noon pacific tomorrow but

05:16     let's go through what's in our thinking

05:17     feeling long program because it's pretty

05:19     amazing there are 17 modules and i call

05:22     them mom lessons i think it's good to

05:25     say - that's important to say that this

05:27     has been developed over a decade oh yeah

05:30     yeah we opened the the first time we

05:33     launched it was seven years ago and the

05:37     reason why I started thinking feeling

05:40     willing was because I found that in our

05:43     my coaching practice I was saying the

05:46     same thing over and over again I was

05:48     sending people the same like I wouldn't

05:50     they somebody would say I don't know how

05:51     this song goes and so I would record it

05:53     and send it to them and then I had like

05:54     10 more people ask the same question or

05:56     I where's the best place I can find a

06:00     YouTube video for learning how to knit

06:02     and I would be like well how about I

06:03     just teach you yeah I was

06:05     there were there were things that I was

06:07     doing over and over and over again and

06:10     so I had this like spiritual prompting

06:13     like you know you should put all this in

06:14     one place so it started and started on a

06:17     blog that was password-protected seven

06:19     years ago and it was yea it was teeny

06:21     and had to change the password every

06:23     month because some people that aren't

06:26     very savory would hop on there and then

06:28     share the password on some Facebook

06:29     group and then everybody would have it

06:31     and so we had like we had many

06:34     incarnations and I actually really loved

06:37     where we are right now we just rebuilt

06:39     the membership part of our site with a

06:42     company called kajabi and they are

06:44     really robust as far as what they can do

06:47     for our students and I love it because

06:50     it also means that we have an off

06:53     Facebook support group so all of the

06:56     moms that don't really want to be on

06:57     Facebook but they're loving it like at

07:00     first I thought well I'm just gonna say

07:01     that we're just opening this what I what

07:04     I've noticed is that people are diving

07:06     deep like the Facebook end right now is

07:09     dead there's not a lot going on over

07:11     there everybody is in the new the new

07:15     support group that we created and so

07:17     super happy about that I'm super happy

07:19     that it is so full so so I love that

07:23     aspect of it because you have hundreds

07:26     of moms that are on the same path as you

07:28     and that have either walked it or

07:30     they're still walking it and and we have

07:33     a lot of season mums in there a lot of

07:34     brand spanking new moms in their moms

07:37     that are just like learned about Waldorf

07:38     yesterday and jumped on board moms that

07:41     have been doing Walter for all the time

07:42     moms that have little tiny kids moms

07:44     that have adult children so it is a true

07:48     community of people that are in going in

07:52     the same direction and there's actually

07:54     a dad's section in there that we're

07:56     gonna get up and going soon Erica's

07:58     gonna be hopping there more and we're

07:59     hoping that we can get some dads and

08:02     because really and truly this is not

08:05     just mom's job you know I think that

08:08     often it's seen as just BOMs job but

08:10     there are a lot of things that come up

08:11     like holding a space that Grant talked

08:13     about today that really daddy's been

08:16     involved in and then he's going to do we

08:18     different than mom does and so we really

08:21     we really wanted a place that was that

08:23     was comfortable for everybody so we have

08:26     that so we have this great support

08:27     system but we also have these modules

08:29     and like I said they're called the mom

08:31     less and so if you're if you've heard

08:33     about them on the Internet

08:34     I have a lot of people that send me a

08:35     message and go I just want to know how

08:37     can I get just the mom lesson I go it

08:39     doesn't work that way it's a whole big

08:41     program and the reason being there's

08:44     much more than just the mom lesson so

08:46     there's some own lessons and then we

08:48     also do regular training like this one

08:50     that we're doing tonight I'm holding the

08:51     space is something that happens for

08:53     those members on a regular basis we also

08:56     have weekly office hours where you can

08:59     come and just get help from me and it's

09:01     we do them over zoom and and that's just

09:05     like an online video conferencing you

09:07     can hop in there asking your questions

09:08     and I can answer them sometimes it'll

09:10     just be you and I sometimes it'll be me

09:12     and for other people but the idea is

09:14     that I'm there I'm answering questions

09:16     you have access to me I also have access

09:18     to me on the support group and you can

09:20     also email me if you need to so it is

09:22     I'm very much involved in it and I'm

09:24     very much there to help moms the other

09:27     great thing is this we also have leaders

09:29     across the United States and hopefully

09:31     soon across the world and they have

09:34     taken on this like mantle of

09:36     responsibility where they have they

09:39     speak for us in the areas that they're

09:42     in we have a leader in Florida we have a

09:45     to leaders in Colorado we have a team a

09:49     set of leaders in South Carolina we have

09:52     a leader that covers Indiana and

09:54     Kentucky and we have a leader in Salt

09:57     Lake City I'm missing somebody I feel

10:00     like I'm missing 70 yes I am Detroit Oh

10:04     Detroit and so we have leaders all over

10:07     the United States and

10:08     we're actually our dream is to have

10:11     leaders in every state on every

10:14     continent so that they can be me when

10:17     I'm not there when I can't be with you

10:18     another great thing is is I I have this

10:21     this desire to go and be able to be with

10:25     those groups so that then we can

10:27     interact and it gives you an opportunity

10:28     to have you know to have somebody can

10:32     speeder on the ground there who knows

10:34     her stuff and who you know who's been

10:37     trained by me who knows what they're

10:38     doing not just in the curriculum realm

10:41     but in the coaching realm too so we are

10:44     doing we have a coaching program that we

10:48     are working on that will be a

10:50     requirement for all of our leaders from

10:52     here on in and so I I want them to be

10:55     able to bring you what I can bring you

10:56     and it's great with if it's when I want

10:59     it personal so if you're interested in

11:01     any of those leaders drop you know I'm

11:02     happy to set you up okay so our mom

11:06     lessons like yeah I promise to stand

11:08     turn this time so the first one is read

11:10     them it's a whole like if you've ever

11:14     struggled with rhythm or you don't even

11:15     know what in the heck or the mess we

11:17     will get to sorbets rhythm is this the

11:20     first lesson the welder curriculum is

11:22     the second lesson and that goes into

11:23     reading Steiner understanding Steiner

11:26     understanding what he meant for the each

11:27     of the grades all of that inner work

11:30     which is this vast this vast thing that

11:35     so many that you know it's it's so B but

11:37     the inner work it encompasses a lot of

11:39     things it also encompasses temperament

11:41     which is has a long lesson of its own

11:43     because temperament can be so confusing

11:46     I think sometimes our people to

11:48     understand we have a mamasan handwork so

11:51     learning had all the ins and outs of

11:53     handwork and patterns to practice fine

11:57     music we have them on less than our

11:58     music teaching you we we actually

12:01     provide the music unfolds curriculum

12:03     then I co-wrote with Kimberly persons a

12:05     year ago and it goes through from

12:08     kindergarten to third grade

12:10     teaching you how to read music teaching

12:12     you how to teach your child it's

12:14     actually really beautiful we have a

12:16     month less than unformed wrong

12:17     understanding form drying all the forms

12:19     all of them so you have a well to pull

12:23     from as your as you're going through

12:25     your curriculum and through your grades

12:28     we have them on lesson on planning where

12:30     our planning for piece journal and that

12:32     course is part of that so we teach a

12:35     course on planning that starts the first

12:38     part of May this year and will go all

12:40     the way through September and I will

12:41     walk you through every single step on

12:43     what you need to do to get ready for the

12:45     school year

12:46     so that's part of thinking feeling

12:48     willing painting and drawing we teach

12:50     you how to paint draw the Waldorf Way

12:52     modeling we teach you modeling

12:54     indications for each year sort of how

12:57     they change and what materials to use of

13:00     that kind of thing we go through

13:02     festivals though all their festivals and

13:04     they're the great thing about the

13:06     support group now and having this all

13:09     together is that you know maybe there's

13:11     a festival that you you really want to

13:13     celebrate but you you want to know how

13:14     their people are doing it you hop on the

13:16     support group and say hey what are you

13:18     all doing for Michaelmas and then you'll

13:19     get everybody's answer for what they're

13:22     doing so you can pick what works for you

13:24     so that's what's so lovely about having

13:26     the support group we have a lesson on

13:29     learning how to write your own

13:30     curriculum so it takes you through all

13:32     of the steps of like what you should be

13:34     thinking about I definitely don't

13:35     recommend that you do that your first

13:37     year out I recommend that you get your

13:39     feet wet a little bit and learn

13:42     time understanding the recommendations

13:44     and why they are the way they are but

13:47     but it's that's a really robust program

13:50     in in itself it's a it's a course in

13:52     itself and it's part of the mom lessons

13:55     and with that course we go through not

13:58     just Steiners recommendations but I also

14:00     take the government standards for the

14:01     United States the common core and I

14:03     talked about how you can meet those

14:05     things within life Steiners work and

14:08     give you notes for all the grades that I

14:10     have taught and everything we have

14:13     listened on schooling several children a

14:15     lesson on creating circle time like

14:19     circle time creation because that can be

14:21     like it baffles people sometimes I go

14:22     it's okay calm down

14:23     it's a big deal I promise just think

14:26     it'll be fine so that's like another

14:29     course in itself but it's great it's in

14:32     the mom lessons there's a hundred and

14:34     thirty six songs that I said remember

14:36     when I was recording all those songs oh

14:38     my gosh I didn't want to talk for like

14:40     two days afterwards don't talk to me

14:42     recorded a lot of songs so and they're

14:45     not all in perfect pitch but they're all

14:46     recorded so you know the tunes to them

14:49     as you have all of that there we also

14:52     have we just added reading writing and

14:54     spelling the Waldorf way this lastv

14:57     winter fall we added that one what else

15:00     do we have we have our thrive program

15:03     which actually tonight's little lesson

15:06     comes from our three program the whole

15:08     idea of holding the space we have a

15:10     whole section on how moms and dads can

15:12     hold the space within our three program

15:14     and it is warm in here sorry y'all is

15:17     hot we would have it at the light plus

15:20     it's already warm today we would have

15:23     the fans on but

15:24     you know here huh so what other wine am

15:27     I missing I think I got them all I think

15:30     I think I got them oh I do have one in

15:32     the works that's sort of back here in my

15:34     head that's not I haven't talked about

15:36     it a whole lot but I'm planning to do a

15:37     whole one lesson I'll sleep how many

15:39     times do we counsel people on sleep a

15:41     lot we talk a lot about sleep so within

15:45     that you also get my dear friend Zig

15:50     Linda D Francesca who is the owner of

15:52     teach wonderment and the writer of the

15:54     dawn save gnome series you get her heart

15:57     downloads for the Covenant block grants

16:02     sorry that momentarily left my head so

16:03     you get that so you'll learn how to

16:05     color with block grants and it's it's a

16:07     lot of fun let's see what else do you

16:09     get you can get instant access to just

16:11     about everything in our store so yeah I

16:14     think and you get it for life so you pay

16:17     one time and somebody was asking me this

16:20     day do I have to buy it for every

16:21     student no you buy it one time it's per

16:24     family but one time and it lasts you for

16:27     the whole thing like for like it's a

16:29     lifetime program you have lifetime

16:30     access to it and there's no like set

16:33     time that you have to do things it's

16:35     self-paced but we do sort of keep you

16:37     going

16:38     we only launched it a couple of times a

16:41     year now we used to have it open all the

16:43     time what I found myself doing was

16:44     spending a lot of energy catching the

16:46     people up every time and so now we do it

16:49     a couple of times a year so that I can

16:52     onboard everybody at the same time we

16:54     can get started at the same time I can

16:55     get you all going are you gonna yawn

16:57     he's been out with children all day yeah

17:00     and he came home and was like hey I

17:02     think you should do this with me he goes

17:04     I can't go change my clothes and this

17:08     woman here when we drove all the way to

17:09     he went to Mexico today to get a pinata

17:11     I have to show this big honor I didn't

17:15     buy that in Mexico

17:16     let's buy it with buy Mexico I don't get

17:18     amazement it's a gigantic act

17:23     Soraya's afraid of piñatas and so I

17:25     guess I was amazed I mean cactuses so

17:29     that it was her birthday on Monday and

17:33     so we're having a gigantic party with

17:36     everybody except for y'all Kelly needs

17:40     some prayers our assistant Kelly was on

17:42     her way here and she stayed in Vegas

17:46     last night and somebody stole her car so

17:49     she's not coming here so that friend I'm

17:51     sad about but I'm more sad about the

17:52     fact that somebody stole her car yeah

17:54     she has to turn around and go home it's

17:56     super sad so if y'all are a meatball

17:58     Kelly and her family I just I just can't

18:02     believe that happen

18:03     but the pinatas for this giant party my

18:05     mom's coming Eric's parents are coming

18:07     all of my adult children I'm gonna be

18:08     there for sir as a birthday party so

18:10     that's Friday it's going to be very I

18:12     left the country today I came back

18:15     what's your small talk and now I'm live

18:17     on did you guys get churros today no but

18:22     they asked you for Charles no they

18:24     didn't is that misters is my thing

18:26     you know they didn't ask me for that I

18:28     usually I like to go to Mexico just to

18:30     get your us cuz we're that close the

18:32     Border Patrol guys are always like why'd

18:33     you go to Mexico I said to my churros no

18:35     I

18:35     are you kidding me lady no not kidding

18:38     you see my churros and other things I

18:40     was doing there yeah and then I got hit

18:43     in the way back home that I'm here it's

18:45     variegated they want to know where I was

18:48     born yeah anyway before I could come

18:52     home yeah that's fine so anyway I am

18:55     gonna get to our talk tonight thank you

18:57     all for listening to our antics it is

18:59     warm in here though I think that's all

19:03     with regards to our thinking feeling

19:04     willing program oh except for those of

19:07     you who like hard copies no hard copies

19:09     are included

19:10     absolutely included and so when you're

19:13     ready for and we recommend you not order

19:15     them all at once

19:17     somebody says please do a video about

19:19     the pragmatics

19:20     and The Melancholy child oh the

19:22     phlegmatic parent and mouth my child do

19:24     that we actually just did our pregnant

19:27     pragmatic oh ok pregnant yeah don't say

19:29     that we won't cover that when we do our

19:32     melancholy we're gonna do a melancholy

19:35     on Monday this coming Monday

19:42     yep this coming Monday at 6 a.m. Pacific

19:45     right here so um what was I saying I'm

19:48     sorry we so hard copies are included now

19:50     so when you are within we recommend you

19:53     don't order them all at once and this is

19:55     why every now and again we will update

19:57     them and you only get one so you can't

20:01     order grade one and then be like oh wait

20:03     a minute so I try to be like open when I

20:05     know that we're doing an update window

20:07     so I would or just such a name for the

20:10     year and that's kind of our role you canv

20:12     order play for peace journal every year

20:13     and so you always have a fresh new in

20:15     what just the idea so that you use it so

20:18     anyways now let's talk about holding the

20:19     space yes but I will remind you special

20:22     awesomeness for those who buy during our

20:25     video tonight presents from me okay

20:32     holding the space clothing this week do

20:35     you kids like this this is the best way

20:38     for me to explain holding the space

20:40     everything's going nice nobody's

20:42     fighting and then the phone rings and

20:44     you pick it up and you start talking on

20:46     it and then everything goes to hell in a

20:47     handbasket

20:48     that's because your energy went away

20:50     mm-hmm so holding the space is about

20:53     like your energetic presence and and

20:56     that's not something woowoo because

20:57     everything is energy

20:58     that's like scientific so when your

21:03     energy is withdrawn from that space of

21:05     like being with them they feel it and

21:08     because they're little people and they

21:10     don't know how to articulate it it often

21:13     comes out and like punching their

21:14     brother or somebody falls or the dog

21:19     throws up or like everything's like goes

21:22     crazy and sometimes they do something

21:25     that you would have never thought and he

21:27     human mind would comprehend that that

21:29     would be a thing to do there are rules

21:31     that I have made in my parenting that I

21:34     thought to myself I cannot believe these

21:37     words hey and we won't embarrass anybody

21:43     today no but you can all probably think

21:46     that something oh yeah we have five

21:50     children there's never a dull moment in

21:51     our house and I there have been times I

21:53     have gone I have said I can't believe I

21:55     had to just tell you you can't do that

21:57     why would you do that to begin with it

21:59     but you know a lot being able laugh at

22:01     yourself as a parent is is I think

22:03     recipe for a happy life so make sure you

22:07     laugh at yourself enough but holding the

22:09     space is this this concept that when you

22:13     are energetically present and that means

22:16     you're not just your it's not just your

22:18     body's there because you can't be on

22:19     your phone and hold the space you can't

22:21     be deep into a novel in all the space

22:22     you can't be listening to a podcast and

22:25     all in the space holding the space means

22:27     that you are energetically present

22:28     doesn't mean you have to be playing with

22:30     them because moms will say that me often

22:31     like do I have to play with my kids all

22:33     day I'm like hell no gods do happen no

22:35     don't do that in fact that sets them up

22:37     for failure I think when you're

22:39     constantly playing with them you have to

22:42     give them that space to understand how

22:44     to play yes and and I think that often

22:47     children if they had too much mania and

22:51     that can I mean too much media for one

22:55     child is nothing to somebody else but

22:56     yeah certain temperaments if they've had

22:58     too much media then they kind of forget

22:59     how to play you have to sort of go on a

23:01     media diet and remind them how to play

23:03     well one of the biggest indications to

23:05     me is when it's time to turn that off

23:08     and let me anger there's anger then a

23:10     tantrum okay that scent indication that

23:13     they had weights may catch it there that

23:16     mad about it and so I mean that's when I

23:19     know I mean there's other things that

23:21     tell you they've had too much and you're

23:23     Stern rules all only but if it's you've

23:28     got five minutes and it's off and then

23:30     five minutes

23:31     then it goes off and they're like yeah

23:35     like that then it's like okay and I

23:37     think there's a couple of things to

23:38     remember with the time warning yeah so

23:40     like when children don't really

23:42     understand the passage of time until

23:43     they're in about second grade and so 10

23:46     minutes to a two of five or six or even

23:48     seven year old it is not the same thing

23:51     as ten minutes to your eye and so you

23:53     want to be really careful about yeah I

23:56     mean usually would say it's going to go

23:58     off when this episode is over or you

24:02     know or something along those lines so

24:04     that you you are giving the expectation

24:06     and and if it's time if it's a child

24:08     that can understand that the passage of

24:10     time that I have seen older children

24:13     have tantrums and I go excuse me I mean

24:17     then you have things like Netflix where

24:19     if you're saying place you can watch

24:25     this and I need to be done in the notes

24:26     like if you're busy that's right so

24:29     what's up again the next one in Exmouth

24:31     and they're like well because Netflix

24:33     are really frosty in 13 seconds and

24:36     another episode is playing so you want

24:38     to be like you want to be careful if you

24:40     are using media at all to help you get

24:42     something done and now I'm not a

24:44     proponent of that like at all I would

24:47     say figure out a way to get it done with

24:48     them have them come and help you for

24:50     sure but I know that the reality for

24:52     some parents as they are stepping away

24:54     from media more and more is that they

24:56     are using it at certain periods of the

24:58     day so here's the thing most children's

25:01     shows lasts between 17 and 22 minutes

25:04     look at how long it is it's a great

25:07     little like when you push pause to tell

25:09     you how many minutes are left so then

25:10     your job is to set your watch or to pay

25:12     attention and if you are if you're using

25:15     the TV as a babysitter for 12 minutes

25:17     then you go get everything done that you

25:19     need get done in 12 minutes and come

25:20     back and be present being present that's

25:23     weird turning point as Kaitlyn says my

25:27     daughter doesn't get mad when we turn it

25:29     off or take away the screens but

25:30     definitely doesn't know how to keep

25:32     yourself entertained so I think that

25:37     Caitlyn is she an only child I think

25:40     there's definitely differences when

25:43     you've got because we have we don't have

25:46     commit fight show so I have the only

25:48     children situation but we have gaps big

25:50     gaps between the last two for sure so

25:53     there were definitely periods of time

25:55     when it wasn't working for one child to

25:58     play with the other and so you know

26:00     those children had to learn how to yes

26:04     she says yes one-and-done

26:05     they have to learn how to sort of

26:08     entertain themselves there are lots of

26:09     things that I would consider our

26:12     youngest loves handwork and she has for

26:14     a long time she loves painting and

26:16     drawing and so I have always had those

26:20     materials out for her like she's been

26:23     she's been painting since she was

26:24     probably 2 or 3 like by herself on her

26:28     own she can get the paper she has a

26:30     paint palette and we actually have a

26:32     video on you know art supplies for young

26:35     children so if you need it I can hook

26:36     you up with that but she she can go get

26:40     in herself she's knows how to rinse her

26:42     paint brush and all of that and yes it

26:44     gets it herself and paints on her own so

26:47     I have left the those spaces open for

26:50     her so that she can do those things on

26:53     her own she also is like who likes to

26:56     help so you know she'll she'll find

26:59     things to do that are helpful or I need

27:00     to be sitting at the table and it's not

27:02     something that she can actually do to

27:04     help I will suggest something that she

27:06     can do you know come and sit next to

27:09     mommy going should go get your crayons

27:10     and come and sit next to me while I'm

27:11     doing this you can do that you're still

27:13     holding the space because you're

27:14     energetically they're still but where

27:18     the problem is yeah it begins is when

27:20     you you start to check out and then not

27:24     only do they not know how to

27:25     taine themselves and they're struggling

27:27     with that but then because they feel

27:30     that energetic separation they don't

27:33     know what to do with it and they that's

27:35     and it's not just when naughtiness

27:36     happens it's when you know accidents

27:40     happen it's when they start to fall

27:42     apart it's there they're having a

27:44     struggle because they need that

27:46     energetic piece from you at least until

27:49     7 then it starts to that sort of tharok

27:54     bond starts to change a bit but then

27:56     they need they can't hold the space on

27:58     their own until they're a teenager and

28:02     even then certain temperaments are

28:03     better at it than others I think that's

28:06     part of what we're teaching them you

28:08     know we're not raising children and

28:09     raising adults we want work because if

28:12     we're raising children just be teaching

28:13     people how to be children we're teaching

28:15     people how to eventually be adults in a

28:17     very developmentally appropriate way so

28:19     you want to be very sort of you know a

28:23     concerted effort and you're deciding how

28:25     to do it I do want to say moms and dads

28:27     hold the space differently yeah which is

28:30     why he's here

28:31     well I dads I think apt I think often

28:35     dads will rely on at least in our

28:37     culture today they'll pull out their

28:39     phone yeah so I mean Lauren says I'm an

28:43     only child and I can see this being an

28:45     issue and I see how easy it is for my

28:47     kid to be occupied with other kids

28:48     around yeah well I have one example I

28:52     can think of of how we hold the space

28:54     differently is I remember I was out

28:57     running errands and I called you on the

28:59     phone because I we were discussing what

29:02     I was trying to find today

29:03     no like and I just had to write it well

29:08     when when I'm alone with her she has

29:10     this idea that when the car stops she's

29:12     going to unbuckle

29:13     until yeah get out of her seat and she

29:15     wouldn't do that to you but I was a

29:17     knocking on the phone and the next thing

29:21     I know she's flipping over the front

29:23     right the front passenger seat lands on

29:26     something breaks it and you're like why

29:29     was she even doing that in the car

29:31     like I don't know I was on the phone and

29:33     she just does it right there are things

29:36     that I think that there are things that

29:38     children would never dream to do with

29:39     mom and there are things that they would

29:41     never dream to do with that like ever

29:43     and in in that's just a testament to the

29:49     strong bonds you have with your children

29:51     that you and your partner have a

29:52     different bond and I actually really

29:54     love that I really love that if I'm

29:57     holding the space with the kids and it's

29:59     just us and or you know we're not doing

30:01     school and there's no media going we're

30:03     just hanging out I'm likely just gonna

30:06     be sitting there knitting and they're

30:07     gonna be talking to me we might be

30:08     listening to a story when but if dad's

30:10     holding the space with them they're you

30:13     know they're more apt to say let's play

30:15     a game let's do you know so they're

30:17     because he holds it differently and he

30:19     brings a different energy to it

30:21     I I think that to help dads get away

30:25     from like what do I do it then when I'm

30:26     holding the space because we hear some I

30:28     don't hear well I'm babysitting and I go

30:30     you're not babysitting that is not what

30:32     it's called when you're with your child

30:33     you're gone repair of parenting so you

30:36     have to like put tools in your toolbox

30:38     and I think that that's appropriate for

30:40     mom and dad because I think often mods

30:42     also don't know how to hold the space so

30:44     they go what do I do

30:46     they're just playing that doesn't mean

30:50     you should retreat into your phone or

30:53     because that's what happens is when you

30:54     do retreat into your phone that's when

30:57     that's when stuff happens even our

31:00     children who are pretty well trained

31:02     that if I am on my phone I try to hide

31:05     it's because I'm answering a work

31:07     question they're still gonna be like hey

31:10     mom hey mom hey mom like the little dog

31:12     and yeah in those those old cartoons

31:15     yeah like polishers yes like they're

31:19     they need something when when you're

31:23     engaged because they feel your energy

31:25     gone so Genesis so much yes Ella loves

31:28     to test her dad he is struggling to hold

31:31     the space as well as to find ways to

31:33     connect in discipline I think that you

31:36     said two important things there Jenna I

31:37     think when you connect you don't have to

31:39     discipline

31:40     much because you're you're making that

31:43     connection there they will if you have a

31:45     plan and it doesn't have to be like oh I

31:48     planned everything out like in my weird

31:49     choleric way like just a plan like when

31:52     I'm with the kids we're gonna read book

31:53     certain I'm alone what the kids are

31:54     gonna plan to know when I'm alone you

31:56     know whatever it is if you have a plan

31:59     to enroll your child in you know what it

32:04     is and that dad wants to do with them

32:06     then you won't have a discipline issue

32:09     generally generally later later on I

32:14     mean with this is really funny but later

32:16     on when we had small kids and like

32:20     teenager almost adult kids in the house

32:22     at the same time and if you were gone I

32:25     would have the older kids take issue

32:27     with how I was holding the space with

32:29     the younger ones they would even text me

32:31     and tackle on him I'll say you know what

32:34     he's my job is to say he's got it under

32:37     control I don't need to hear about it

32:39     and sometimes they they may have a point

32:42     we just had this recently where you were

32:44     you I it was right before our launch and

32:48     and we had a Disneyland a plan because

32:50     we live in Southern California did

32:51     Disneyland a plan and I knew that was

32:54     not where I needed to be and so Eric

32:56     took he took our old adult son and Sam

32:59     and Soraya and they went this is what I

33:02     hear from Mary she would not be pulling

33:04     this if you were here it was like okay

33:09     well but I'm not so it's okay it's okay

33:12     so when you had that I think it's really

33:14     important when you your kids get older

33:15     and they start to report to you you just

33:18     go that's okay

33:20     I know you can handle it or that's okay

33:22     she's got it under control because the

33:24     toweling is this dividing conquer thing

33:26     that I think they do

33:28     subconsciously without even knowing and

33:30     it goes back to my whole theory called

33:32     who's got my boob yeah and the who's got

33:34     my boob theory is it doesn't matter

33:36     how many children you have it doesn't

33:39     matter how old they are they will always

33:41     vie for your attention mom always like I

33:44     have watched it in adult children like

33:48     Iowa every time we're around all of your

33:50     siblings they all they don't want to

33:51     talk to us mother don't want our baby

33:53     buddy I'll do it time to your dad it's

33:56     all and then they all it says just it's

33:58     just one person wants to talk to you on

33:59     they all want to talk to his mom at the

34:01     same time and so as your children become

34:04     adults you sort of see it and it will be

34:06     very interesting because we have one

34:07     child that doesn't want to talk to me at

34:08     all right now but it'd be very

34:09     interesting when everybody else is

34:11     trying to talk to me if she actually

34:12     wants to talk to me during that time

34:14     period because I think that there is

34:16     this this energy difference between mom

34:19     and dad I know we live in this culture

34:20     where they want to make everything the

34:22     same and there everybody holds a

34:25     different energy and so you know you

34:28     kind of want to own that and be okay

34:31     with that and and find healthy ways to

34:34     express that find healthy ways to you

34:37     know have fun with your children and and

34:40     I think often when dad's gone at work

34:42     all day I mean you used to be that dad

34:44     that was gone all day you have to

34:46     consciously think about what are we

34:48     gonna do that's not like just a video

34:51     game or that's not like just a movie you

34:53     have to consciously think about well

34:55     what is it that they would want to do

34:56     and what is it that what they would want

34:58     to do with me that's different than what

35:00     they're doing with mom all day yeah

35:03     what would you say from a dad's

35:08     perspective of like understanding the

35:10     difference between like like seeing it

35:12     palpably seeing it what happens between

35:15     when you hold it and when you don't it's

35:21     there's a chaotic energy and there

35:24     energy of kids that aren't feeling

35:28     secure yeah because then when they're

35:30     not feeling secure they tend to question

35:33     everything and they tend to do things

35:36     that they wouldn't do and they do feel

35:37     secure and I think there's just a few

35:39     little tweaks what would you tell

35:41     another dad like if he if you had a dad

35:43     say to you so what is one of the secrets

35:45     yeah what would you say it's being being

35:50     present being mindful listening to

35:52     what's going on around you keying in on

35:55     what the emotions are i keying in to

35:59     what things are saying to each other

36:01     into you because then you know because

36:04     what but the message you're getting is

36:06     hey I don't feel safer I don't know

36:08     what's going on I need to know better

36:11     especially like when they're younger or

36:13     or when they say that they're little

36:15     toddlers but when they're they're big

36:17     enough that they start to wonder about

36:20     the things around them today

36:23     Sariah because we had to go pack

36:25     something I'm gonna say well today you

36:28     know when we I had to pick something up

36:30     on the other side of the brain gray and

36:34     her hair it goes to Mexico to get my

36:37     blood pressure medication because it's

36:38     cheaper there that it is here it's not

36:39     actually like this crazy deal no I'm not

36:42     doing something illegal he just got andv

36:44     actually it's better stuff better so in

36:48     about what some but sometimes we have

36:50     Dennis appointments day like so often

36:53     um I'm we're walking to the border and

36:56     she's asking me all these questions that

36:58     she doesn't normally asked I go well

37:00     what point are we in Mexico and what

37:03     point are we that it stays that lying

37:05     right what happens if you have a like do

37:08     you have passports what happens if we

37:11     don't have passports

37:12     why do those people get to go in that

37:14     line and we have to go and this my

37:16     there's Reliance there's a line for

37:17     foreigners from men lines were Mexican

37:20     penis watering you have to talk to

37:22     somebody you know on the other way and

37:25     yet no matter who you already have to

37:27     answer a bunch of Russians but and then

37:30     let me get the other side he loves that

37:32     part we get to the other side of the

37:36     she's like dad why don't the birds need

37:38     passports and my several birds are more

37:43     free than people are she's also fishing

37:47     desert innate so she's thinking so much

37:50     so much thinking um so much is going on

37:53     in her head but that told me that she

37:56     wasn't sure what was happening and she

37:58     wasn't sure where she was asking

38:00     questions and that astronomy you had

38:02     been buried in your phone she probably

38:04     would have acted up instead of asking

38:05     questions just zoned out or nice not

38:08     paying attention or ignoring her then it

38:10     would have escalated to more and more

38:12     things you know I think that whenever

38:14     you're going to a place like that

38:16     because I think you know that's kind of

38:17     it's not an extreme and it's kind of

38:19     like an most people aren't going to be

38:21     like going to Mexico every day no but I

38:23     think that when you're just out with

38:24     kids you

38:25     have to think about where you're going

38:27     what you could encounter and always have

38:30     an exit strategy why I always have any

38:33     that stretch I mean I end up being the

38:36     one that usually takes them to grocery

38:39     store trips usually I'm the one that

38:41     takes them right and often we sit down

38:44     at my grocery shop for a lot of years he

38:46     can do it knock it off if I made you

38:49     know a Google keep lists with checkboxes

38:51     right because we've talked about what

38:53     the menu is going to be for the link and

38:55     what we need and so I know what we're

38:58     giving and I'll get to the store and

39:01     I'll say look kids this is my list this

39:05     is what we're here to get we're not here

39:07     to tell us and then I know mom told me

39:12     that you shouldn't Ella on the list that

39:14     only happened actually one time when I

39:15     actually did ask him to put Nutella on

39:17     the list yeah then they milk it every

39:19     time and so this is what we got to do

39:23     and we got to get with some of this

39:25     let's say you guys to help me right and

39:28     that's good because that helps them know

39:30     you know I think often in our adult

39:32     minds and I think that this probably is

39:36     is something that dad would struggle

39:38     with more than mom because we're with

39:39     them all day and we take them places

39:41     generally except for in your kiss for

39:43     your home with them often dads like but

39:45     I don't have to think about anybody else

39:46     five days a week and now I have to think

39:48     about these other children these other

39:49     people and I have to think about what

39:52     you know what things to worry about but

39:55     guess what when you put thought to those

39:58     things then you don't have Tantrums yeah

40:02     the first thing that I would say to when

40:04     mom gets ready to leave in hands-off

40:06     holding the space to you dad it's the

40:08     first thing you should say is what was

40:09     the last thing these people ate yes if

40:12     she forgets to tell you you need to ask

40:14     because if you don't ask it's going to

40:16     be that that should be the first thing

40:19     you cue in on when things start to fall

40:21     apart you need to go home no need a

40:23     snack

40:23     and greenness or yeah I usually carry a

40:27     fruit bar or applesauce or something in

40:29     my bag there's what we call the uh

40:30     thirsty monster where it's out of the

40:32     blue website I came out with I'm thirsty

40:35     monsters a real entity I cannot say I

40:37     call it you know thirsty monster because

40:39     it's like I can't live another minute

40:40     without water where's the water we've

40:42     had children try to enact violence over

40:45     they have there's too much sure Oh Mike

40:47     hold up you still got spit in your mouth

40:48     caught me on another thing too I wouldv

40:51     say is you know Melissa and I we do a

40:55     lot of people watching when we're out

40:57     video and we live in this big city andv

40:59     there's lots of different people to

41:00     watch and I think one thing that happens

41:04     is I see parents that are asking

41:07     permission from their kids to do things

41:10     that's a big hotbed for me and stop and

41:15     then once you've handed over because

41:17     there's holding the space but then

41:18     there's another element of when you hand

41:21     over control well I do think there is a

41:24     parenting method that that I and I'm not

41:27     going to mention it here out of respect

41:29     for them but there is a parenting method

41:32     where you give kids a lot of choices and

41:34     that's a really bad idea I'm just gonna

41:37     say never give them a couple of things

41:40     don't ever give them a choice that it

41:42     wouldn't be okay with it like don't ever

41:44     give a consequence that you're not gonna

41:46     follow through on and don't give choices

41:48     that you're not okay with don't go you

41:49     can have this candy or this candy if you

41:51     really don't want them to have candy at

41:52     all and so you don't want to give too

41:55     many choices and be very firm in those

42:00     choices so okay I want to tackle this

42:03     because I think this is a good way so

42:06     how do I address the issue of not

42:08     holding the space with your partner it's

42:10     difficult to sit on the sidelines and

42:12     watch it all go down without overruling

42:14     dad when he is when he is in charge of

42:17     the time and then this mom says I have

42:20     to employ prayer for this so I don't

42:21     undermine

42:22     husband and wait for a moment feels

42:24     right to bring up the topic or an

42:26     invitation yeah absolutely Lauren that

42:28     is absolutely what one of the things

42:31     would be that I would say the other

42:33     thing I mean here's the thing dad knows

42:37     if it went to hell you know and I know

42:40     and so we're we're comfortable enough

42:42     with each other to say I think if they

42:47     had eaten that probably wouldn't have

42:49     happened and he's like yeah I know

42:51     or he'll say the same thing to me you

42:52     know they didn't eat it or or they

42:55     probably probably could use a walk

42:57     because I may not be cute into it I may

43:00     be trying to be present but I'm not

43:02     completely present once it fell apart

43:04     and that's falling apart I call that

43:07     when you do the crime scene

43:08     investigation and it's like okay so this

43:11     happened and before that this happened

43:14     and before that this happened and then

43:17     and then okay

43:19     this is where it started to go and I

43:21     have not write correctly here and I had

43:23     an opportunity to corrected there and I

43:25     had an opportunity and now here yeah one

43:28     of the things that we've gotten really

43:29     good at saying to each other is do you

43:31     want to talk about that like after the

43:33     after it's all happened because nine

43:36     times out of ten he's like no because

43:37     they know where it fell apart or I'll

43:38     say no because I know where it fell

43:40     apart like because we're really good at

43:42     that with each other if not if you're

43:45     not in that place I would absolutely say

43:47     honey I saw what just happened do you

43:51     want me to do you want to talk about

43:52     that don't me to give you some input if

43:55     he says no then then step away the next

44:02     time it happens say it again would you

44:05     like some input on that I've really been

44:07     working on holding the space and you

44:10     know I have these great coaches Melissa

44:12     and Eric can they talk about holding the

44:14     space all the time would you like to

44:15     watch this video with me I think that's

44:17     a really good way like especially

44:19     because Jenna I know that you're you're

44:22     a thinking feeling willing members

44:23     I would grab the Thrive videos on

44:25     holding the space I think that it's

44:29     important to support your partner at all

44:32     costs the only time I would say step in

44:34     is if your partner is hurting your child

44:37     then you step in for sure but that is

44:40     not the case most of the time if your

44:42     partner is making you uncomfortable

44:42     that's not the same as hurting your

44:44     child you can absolutely have a

44:46     conversation later like you could say

44:48     and I've never had to say this to Eric

44:50     for sure but you can absolutely say you

44:52     know why don't you two ever talk to a

44:53     try that way again we're gonna have to

44:55     have words about that and then talk

44:56     about it and that's just when you say

44:59     hurting it's not just physical hurting

45:02     no it's a motor saying like things that

45:04     are like yep

45:06     I mean and that's something we've talked

45:07     yeah my mom gets out of control

45:09     sometimes everybody everybody has a time

45:13     when they need a timeout what's great is

45:15     when my mouth starts to go Eric can hold

45:19     me on the like just it's just gentle

45:21     just take my arm

45:22     I and then I can shut up and I walk away

45:25     and hey that's it's cute like he's like

45:28     oh nice stuff in here I have also really

45:33     been working on like for the last 10

45:35     years on because of my temperament my

45:38     temperament is like I could bark and it

45:41     doesn't bother me and somebody thinks

45:43     I'm yelling and I'm like I wasn't

45:44     yelling that wasn't yelling I could yell

45:46     for you though if you like so I am

45:48     really good at being able to say this is

45:51     gonna come from you much better than it

45:53     is for me it was funny cuz you said last

45:55     last week you talked to our adults I

45:57     think it was like mom must be really madv

45:59     as she said she said to me it wasn't

46:01     last week but it was like back when he

46:04     moved in oh that's right that's right

46:06     that's right and it got to where he knew

46:10     that he had stepped in and big when it

46:12     was me that had to do the talk great hey

46:14     man were like I can't do this you need

46:16     to do it it's like oh man I really must

46:18     have stepped on it if you're coming I

46:19     mean no because you're the same

46:22     temperament make sure he knows that if I

46:24     need you to do it if I have to go in and

46:27     and retcon something or clean something

46:31     up it won't be pretty

46:33     and so yeah but I also know what I

46:39     shouldn't shouldn't say because I'm a

46:40     grown-up and I can pay attention to that

46:43     I'm not we're not gonna do any ads to

46:45     live video today but you are absolutely

46:47     welcome to make a comment in the chat

46:50     box don't read it for short let's see

46:53     Chloe says and ask real questions when

46:56     no as in no is an acceptable answer I

47:00     think it's really important that moms

47:03     and dads talk about these things

47:04     I also think it's important that you

47:07     talk about it when there's not a problem

47:09     so you know if this is a brand new

47:12     concept to you then the things that you

47:14     say what might be you know as as soon as

47:16     this video today and this concept of

47:19     holding the space really intrigued me

47:20     you know I know that like when you and I

47:24     are in the room together I can feel your

47:25     presence I think the kids can feel us to

47:27     like open dialogue have a conversation

47:31     about it and and instead of you know

47:35     instead of assuming that they know what

47:37     you're talking about

47:37     advice a holding the space 9 to 10

47:40     people that don't know anything about

47:42     Waller or anything about the work that

47:45     we do they would go what are you talking

47:47     about so you have to sort of you know

47:49     front-load that with that I'm learning

47:51     about something and I think it's really

47:53     interesting and I've been trying it at

47:55     home while you're gone all day and what

47:57     I'm finding is that when I'm trying it

47:59     at home it really works when I hold the

48:02     space so I was thinking that maybe you

48:05     and I could talk about how to hold the

48:06     space together well we're both home

48:08     together

48:08     and and really sort of like coming at it

48:11     from that way I don't know do you have

48:13     any other way do you have any thoughts

48:15     for men that are like I don't want to

48:17     hear this they should I love this one

48:20     they should just listen to me

48:22     you're right they should however they're

48:26     not gonna so do you want to continue to

48:29     beat your head against the wall or do

48:31     you want to actually do something that

48:32     is practice there's there's a place that

48:39     you have to find yourself where you're

48:42     willing to be humble about some things

48:44     19 is a how come a link with yourself

48:48     and your partner and kids aren't just

48:52     gonna listen because you're the dad

48:55     that would be nice but that is not if

48:57     you think about when you were what I was

48:59     just gonna say did that ever work for

49:00     your parents Mike about when you were a

49:03     kid but anytime I mom sit because I said

49:06     to I'd be like oh really lets me think

49:08     about how that could not be and I would

49:13     say if you resistant to finding ways to

49:16     hold the space and to be present and

49:20     find ways to avoid conflict you just

49:23     compare what things are like now to what

49:25     you'd like them to be and that sometimes

49:27     involves doing some things that are

49:28     uncomfortable or that it that's like

49:32     mess with your pride a little bit but

49:34     and that's not meaning you have to

49:36     compromise on who you are anything like

49:38     that it just means like there are

49:39     certain things that if you want things

49:41     to be a certain way there are certain

49:43     things that you have to do to make him

49:44     that way

49:45     right because I think again we're not

49:47     raising children or we're helping were

49:51     developmentally walking through this

49:53     path to adulthood and you didn't learn

49:57     just by somebody telling you one time

49:59     you learned by somebody systematically

50:02     either good or bad teaching you over

50:05     time so you have to be willing to be in

50:08     the space of teacher not just homeschool

50:11     teacher but I think when it's a when

50:15     someone a mom says to me Oh I'm

50:16     homeschooling that whole family is

50:18     homeschooling not just bomb so it's it's

50:22     something that is mom and

50:25     and and even grandma sometimes

50:27     everybody's involved in that and so

50:30     being able to talk about things and

50:32     really truly communicate is what's so so

50:35     important about you know this path and

50:39     that's what helps you be successful is

50:41     when you're you're willing to step step

50:44     aside and go you know I'm learning here

50:45     I'm trying to sort this out sometimes

50:48     what I find when there's this going all

50:51     the mom and dad about you know learning

50:53     is it mom says you know honey you may

50:55     have this parenting thing I'll figure it

50:57     out but I don't so I am learning that

51:00     often takes that off the hook because

51:02     then he can go oh see here all this time

51:05     I thought she knew everything and she

51:07     doesn't know everything and it's okay

51:08     for us to both be learning together yes

51:10     because I think often dads think oh well

51:13     she's with this child all day she knows

51:14     everything she does all the reading she

51:16     does everything and I don't know

51:18     anything and really and truly when you

51:20     can both come to a place of we're both

51:21     learning and and I welcome you to read

51:24     the stuff that I've been reading and I

51:27     I'll you know come to you you'll come to

51:29     me I think that that's really the

51:31     healthiest place to be anything else

51:35     to think we covered it all do you have

51:37     any questions totally happy dance of

51:40     course I think we're good but there's

51:42     way more to talk about but anyway do

51:44     your own baby give me all that money so

51:46     you can be here all we shouldn't because

51:48     we're gonna have some hangry people for

51:50     you're not careful again this is this

51:54     much of what we cover and I think a

51:56     feeling willing program if you have

51:57     enjoyed this conversation at all you

51:59     should highly consider becoming a member

52:01     we have these kinds of conversations

52:03     often and and I welcome them Eric and I

52:06     welcome them all the time so this is

52:08     this is what we do so again if you are

52:12     going to become a member

52:14     become a member before I push the finish

52:16     button on Facebook on Instagram I have

52:19     something awesome plant alright see you

52:24     guys later join us tomorrow noon pacific

52:26     for understanding authenticity see you

52:30     then

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